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Author Topic: Goodbye, CCA  (Read 2858 times)

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Offline OtherEric

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Goodbye, CCA
« on: January 22, 2011, 09:45:42 AM »
It appears that within the next two months the CCA will be no more; after at least a decade or longer of being more or less meaningless.

I suppose it had some value at its time, but that was long in the past.  There is still some satisfaction in seeing the final nail in its coffin announced.


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Goodbye, CCA
« on: January 22, 2011, 09:45:42 AM »

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #1 on: January 22, 2011, 01:14:18 PM »
I wish they had retooled it.  I can see a lot of use for even the original, restrictive rules in merely (like...I think it's what Milestone did, no?) applying the seal when it meets with approval, but not acting any further.  Because, y'know, there are days when I actually could do without seeing a badly-drawn woman bending over in a thong, someone's severed head bouncing through a few panels, or language that is not (I say as a New Yorker who has known many a truck driver) all that realistic outside of South Park or Archer (both of which are often hilarious, but that's totally not the point...).

Rather than scrap it, I might actually like to see a sign that, "some bureaucrat with a stick up his nethers said this has nothing in it you wouldn't show to a four-year-old," even realizing that different people have different standards about what is "child-safe."

Offline narfstar

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #2 on: January 22, 2011, 02:15:11 PM »
As a high school teacher the language is realistic but not bad enough for what really goes on. Yes it is that bad now. I think the ratings or code have switched to imprints. The safe comics seem to have their own imprints now. So stick with Johnny DC or Boom Kids, etc to play it safe. Thing is many of the kids lines are actually pretty good reads.

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #3 on: January 22, 2011, 03:20:34 PM »
The problem with imprints is that there's no oversight.  You're trusting Archie editors and only those editors, any of whom might have a bad day, forget to pay attention, or miss a reference.  They have other jobs that don't include being the guy that the writers are going to bash for not indulging their "creativity."

And let's not forget Archie's Pre-Code life.  Read Pep #30 and, while the Shield is swearing to fight evil despite losing his powers...after he gets a ticket for speeding recklessly, see what Archie does to keep this nation great (with, I might add, assorted innuendo).

And don't forget the world's most inappropriate catchphrase:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/__dO31_PK2kE/TRqFeQFKbhI/AAAAAAAAFcA/DufP_8X6-WA/s1600/weenies.jpg

On the Johnny DC side...

http://www.dialbforblog.com/archives/436/

Search for "meant for adults," then read from there.  The rest of the article is almost worth reading, if you've got time (everything on the site is), even if it's just "modern DC stinks," but I think the JLU Spectre scene is the really relevant bit.

I realize it's archaic and nobody wants the cost or the time to have someone outside the company preview material before it's released, but I can't imagine a third-party reading anything like this and saying, "yes, I would buy this for my neighbor's young child."

As for the language, the characters aren't high school students.  We mellow as we realize that cursing makes us sound like we couldn't think of anything better to say.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2011, 06:49:34 AM by John C »

Offline Bob Hughes

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #4 on: January 25, 2011, 05:48:13 AM »
The real problem with the comics code was that the publishers involved could never agree to create multiple levels.  Proposals to add "teen" and "restricted" ratings were made each time it was revised but they could never come to an agreement.  Which is mostly what prompted Marvel to leave (besides the fact that Bill Jemas was a jerk) in the first place.  DC de facto left by deciding to issue the majority of it's books without code seals.  Marvel at least had their own rating system.  Now DC does too.
Whether those ratings will actually have any value remains to be seen.  Personally once they put a code seal on a Punisher comic, the thing died from its own hypocrisy as far as I'm concerned.

Offline Roygbiv666

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #5 on: January 25, 2011, 07:01:10 AM »
I'll miss the ubiquitous Comics Code seal.

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #6 on: January 25, 2011, 04:08:21 PM »
I disagree, Bob.  The distributors would've had problems dealing with different approval ratings, then the retailers would've had problems keeping their end together.  We weren't as lawsuit-happy then as we are today, of course, but woe be it to the newsstand owner who dares put the CCA-14 stuff on a rack six inches too low where it's confusable with the CCA-7 material.

The real problem, in my eyes, was in considering the CCA seal a mark of quality rather than one of...essentially a synthetic morality, in that books wouldn't be sold unless they carried the seal.

If you do sell them anyway, then you have your de facto multiple levels (sort of like the "For Mature Readers Only" tag that DC tried for a while), but you also let everybody feel in control.  Readers can choose.  Parents can make demands (like explicit-lyric CDs--people besides me still by CDs, right?).  Towns can require ID checks.  Shop owners can decide between height requirements or tacky "porn-hiding curtains" (or not carrying them at all, sure).

And again, I can't help but think that the situation might be improved just by having someone call an editor to say, "the villain seems rather stereotypically gay.  You might get angry calls."  In-house, you get too much intellectual in-breeding to see when your really clever idea is actually just an offensive inside joke.

(For what it's worth, in today's world where creators actually know the names and faces of many fans, I've wondered if a community-driven content rating might be useful.  But getting information where it needs to be securely in an industry that's terrified of online piracy...might be a difficult aspect.  However, imagine, for example, not only having a "13+" age rating, but having a website where the reviewer can say it's because we're forced to look at Sue Storm in her underwear, Archie fantasizes about decapitating Reggie, or Superman says "crap.")

Offline Yoc

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #7 on: January 25, 2011, 07:22:23 PM »
Interesting idea John.
Reminds me of the old DC 'Editorial Advisory Board' only online with fans instead.

-Yoc

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #8 on: January 26, 2011, 06:37:47 AM »
That may not be surprising:  Considering that DC's internal code became the basis for the Comics Code, it'd make sense if the related censorship board evolved from their advisory board.  After all, as far as I can tell, the presence of the advisory board was the predecessor of the CCA seal:  These guys said we're on the up and up.

Of course, the idea is the easy part.  Getting into a viable state, complimentary (or at least not damaging) to the main business model (of comics, I mean), and then getting acceptance by the companies...well, that's something else entirely.

Offline Yoc

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2011, 10:19:31 AM »
Yep.
Things sure have changed from the days of the 'Hey Kids, COMICS!' spinner racks in every variety store.
I don't know any kids that even read them these days.  *sigh*

Offline Bob Hughes

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2011, 02:46:37 PM »
I don't think a multiple age comics code would have been any more problematic than movie or video ratings or video game ratings.  And my grocery store when I was a kid always put the Playboys right next to the comics- which was cool because I could pretend to be looking at the comics and not where I wasn't supposed to be.

According to Newsarama the Code actually went out of existence a year ago- as the contract with Holly Munter's company expired at the end of 2009.  Publishers have apparently just been sticking the seal on the cover anyway for the past year. 

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2011, 04:04:00 PM »
According to Newsarama the Code actually went out of existence a year ago- as the contract with Holly Munter's company expired at the end of 2009.  Publishers have apparently just been sticking the seal on the cover anyway for the past year. 

That's hilarious, actually.  And probably a lawsuit waiting to happen.

(I'll be honest.  If I were a small-press publisher with extra money to throw around, it'd interest me greatly to get my hands on the seal copyright and related IP.  It's probably the only recognizable Ira Schnapp pieces that isn't strongly associated with some DC trademark, so it'd be a nifty thing to own, and there are plenty of people who I'm sure would like to nostalgically (or more likely ironically) put the seal on their book, so making it available would be a nice service.

Offline bminor

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2011, 08:31:49 PM »
I have really enjoyed this site when it comes to the early history of Marvel comics.

http://www.thecomicbooks.com/nsp1-06.html

It covers the silver age of Marvel in four phases. The Early, Formative Years, The Years of Consolidate, The Grandiose Years, and finally The Twilight Years. I really enjoyed this site. They also have cover scans of just about ever Marvel comic book ever made!

This website has been put into book form, unfortunately they are not able to use the covers from Marvel in the book, copyright issues I suppose.

Hope you like the site!

Yours,
Brian M.



Offline Yoc

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #13 on: January 29, 2011, 09:55:42 AM »
A little bit more on the end of the CCA and a question of what became of their archives which would be fascinating reading for comics historians.
http://www.comicsbeat.com/2011/01/27/so-now-who-owns-the-comics-codes-historical-archives/

Russ Maheras posted scans of 1950s-era Code material including retail stickers and the Code’s then-current tri-fold informational brochure here:
http://archives.tcj.com/messboard/viewtopic.php?p=105866&sid=cca0e6cd095dc089dedc8238a805188c

Fun stuff to see!

Offline John C

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Re: Goodbye, CCA
« Reply #14 on: January 29, 2011, 10:36:44 AM »
Seems like an odd situation to me.  Why would the CMAA ship all their materials to DC, essentially a former client?  Is it that they're considered "members" and DC's is the last membership to lapse, making them all that was left?

But more to the point, since it presumably has information on all content submitted, wouldn't it be illegal for someone to expose that to a private organization?  Presumably, the CMAA had some sort of contract with members regarding non-disclosure.  I can't imagine getting Marvel's buy-in, for example, unless you promise never to show anybody at another company what they're working on.

Yes, you could argue that it doesn't make a difference now, but a breach of contract is still a breach of contract that can get quite a few people into trouble, I would think.

Hopefully, we'll see how this all turns out, and it won't get brushed under the carpet by Time-Warner.