General Category > Comic Related Discussion
Holyoke is a Myth...
narfstar:
Thanks Jim nice and concise. I do not think anyone wants to split Speed out of Harvey. What I would like to do when I have the time is tag the end of each file name. Should all but Holyoke be tagged as Tem-xxxx?
JVJ (RIP):
--- Quote from: narfstar on April 08, 2010, 07:38:40 PM ---Thanks Jim nice and concise. I do not think anyone wants to split Speed out of Harvey. What I would like to do when I have the time is tag the end of each file name. Should all but Holyoke be tagged as Tem-xxxx?
--- End quote ---
But really, narf,
It's not about what "people" want, it's about what's historically accurate. Again, I cite the example of Blue Beetle. Let's do what's right and "people" will figure it out. Honest.
I've given Yoc my suggestions for the various "buckets" into which I believe the books should be filed. I suggested that he share those ideas with the forum, but he seems to be busy with non-DCM issues in his life and hasn't gotten to it yet. There's no rush. These things have been mixed up for 50 years. A couple of more days isn't going to hurt anything....
Peace, Jim (|:{>
JVJ (RIP):
--- Quote from: fox_centaur on April 08, 2010, 02:59:03 PM ---
Thanks, Jim! BTW when I was quoting from Champ #12 I didn't mean to lecture you on a comic you had already examined, but I figured not everyone knew the full context of the OS there- it's particularly interesting how the indicia and OS provide two snapshots of Greenwald acquiring the title from Worth. The fact that there was (however briefly) a period where Greenwald controlled the title under the original Worth company name seems interesting. While the OS comes from the same cover month as #11 (and therefore a few months after its production), I've wondered whether #11 changed to Champ Comics (from Champion Comics) and was delayed by a month because Greenwald was already taking it over. Have you seen #11 and does it have anything interesting? For instance, was Worth B. Carnahan still credited as editor in the indicia (and if not, when does that stop? I know he is in #4 but I haven't looked at #5-11).
thanks again,
-henry
--- End quote ---
I didn't take it as a "lecture", Henry,
by all means share information in as much detail as possible.
My list says that I DO have Champ #11, but it's either upstairs or in the mail to Hames Ware. Or perhaps my list is in error. As I was mentioning to Hames earlier today, not having physical access to my comics makes me feel very retarded. Because I never NEEDED to remember all of the details (I simply went upstairs and looked at my notes or at the actual comics), I never DID remember them. Now that I'm physically restricted from jumping up and going upstairs, I feel as if I've had some sort of frontal lobotomy where I can't access half of what I "know". So, alas, I DON'T know if WBC is still listed as the editor. Sorry.
Hames and I suspect that the Ownership Statement in Champ #12 was a done deal when the transfer of ownership happened - in fact the issue may have been ready for the printer. Perhaps, as you say, it was delayed due to the "sale" (which would explain the four month gap between 11 and 12. FYI, here the information on the Worth Champions that I own (or have seen first hand).
CHAMPION COMICS
3 1/40 Worth Pub. Co. ed. 1 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: pending Cleveland, OH
pub @ 1213 West 3rd St, Cleveland OH
ZERO content connection to Temerson or Speed - all typical Barreaux material and characters.
4 2/40 Worth Pub. Co. 1 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: NYC
5 3/40
6 4/40 Worth Pub. Co. 1 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: NYC
7 5/40 Worth Pub. Co. ed. 1 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: Buffalo, NY
pub @ 8 Lord St., Buffalo NY
9 7/40 Worth Pub. Co. ed. 122 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: Buffalo, NY
pub @ 8 Lord St., Buffalo NY
11 10/40 Worth Pub. Co. 122 E 42nd St. NYC 2nd Class: NYC
Adolphe Barreaux is editor
12 2/41 Champ Pub. Co. 225 W 57th St. NYC re-entered as 2nd Class (9/25/40): NYC
listed because of 10/14/40 OS: Owners are Worth Pub. Co. and Leo Greenwald
Peace, Jim (|:{>
OtherEric:
Just as a side note: I'm in mid-edit on several of JVJ's early Speed and Champion issues and should be getting them up for viewing soon. (If I hadn't slept most of today with a nasty cold I would have had at least some already.)
And I've said things like this before but it bears repeating: I don't have much to add to the discussion here but just because I'm not saying anything doesn't mean I'm not finding it fascinating! Thanks to all who DO have useful stuff to say.
Henry Andrews (fox_centaur):
--- Quote from: JVJ on April 08, 2010, 07:19:52 PM ---
--- Quote from: narfstar on April 08, 2010, 06:44:41 PM ---So I'm not the only one. I think I know more and understand less than when all this started.
--- End quote ---
Perhaps this will explain it more clearly, Narf...
http://www.bpib.com/test/GAC/Temerson-by-date-simplified.pdf
--- End quote ---
Great stuff, Jim! Thanks so much for posting. I've gone over it and have some comments, questions and confirmations :-)
Of particular interest to me is whether there really was a Green Hornet Pub. Co. You mentioned earlier that your Green Hornet data was 2nd-hand. I've seen conflicting reports and been unable to nail down exactly what went on with those. The one indicia scan I've seen is from #2 and is only partial. It says that the issue is *copyright* Helnit Pub. Co., but does not show the name of the actual publisher. I might have to track down a copy of this to satisfy my curiosity, but if anyone knows for sure please speak up and save me some money ;-)
Frank Motler and I went through as much of Cat-Man as we could and confirmed a lot of the numbers in the form shown at http://www.comics.com/series/255/ which seems to agree with your list here. The numbers commonly assumed many places were often wrong. I can't find all of my notes right now to figure out which we were missing, but I can definitely confirm that cover #10 is indicia #v2#15, ed.&adv. 220 W. 42nd st., published 5/1942, pub@Holyoke, 2nd Class: Holyoke. I don't think we were able to confirm #v2#13 (8) or #v2#14 (9).
For Cat-Man cover #1 the scan here is blurry, but it's pretty clearly indicia #v1#6.
Captain Fearless #2, 9/1942, is pub@Meriden, Conn. (and 2nd class pending) by Helnit Publishing Co., Inc. Editorial 381 Fourth Avenue, New York City.
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