Digital Comic Museum
General Category => Comic Related Discussion => Topic started by: diablo666 on October 30, 2013, 06:10:16 AM
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My girlfriend’s 9-year old daughter, who has expressed an interest in comic books, and actually one day writing them, recently asked her Mom, “Are there any comic books with girl main characters?” As we all know, most comic books today are not, to put it mildly, particularly kid friendly so I took finding her something appropriate with a “girl main character” as a challenge. Did some research, came up with Supergirl: Cosmic Adventures In the 8th Grade. Not a long-running series, only six issues, but done for kids, with all six issues collected into one trade paperback. Her Mom bought it for her, she loved it. Carried it around with her everywhere. At one point, after all that carrying around, the pages began to come loose from the cover, she rushed up to her Mom, saying, “Fix it, Mommy!”
Also she couldn’t stop telling everyone about Superman’s cousin. She actually wrote, and began directing her sister and the neighbor girls, in a play about Supergirl. Since her little sister is blond, blue-eyed and pretty, and is already taking acting classes and loves them (whereas our budding comic book fan is brown-haired, blue-eyed and pretty and an aspiring writer) this motivated me to say, “One day the older sister will write a Supergirl movie…and her younger sister will star in it.”
Then I discovered the Digital Comic Museum, and all those old Mary Marvel comics. Unlike Supergirl: CAITEG, there is a fair amount of backstory necessary to understand Mary Marvel’s origin, especially since both Captain Marvel and Captain Marvel Jr. show up in MM’s first appearance - she needed to know who those other characters were first. So I started her out with Captain Marvel’s first appearance in Whiz Comics #2. Then, since I wanted her to understand that this Captain Marvel guy is a big deal, one more of the later Cap stories, I chose “Crusher of Crime” from Whiz Comics #20. Right now she’s working on the 3-part introduction of Captain Marvel Jr.
Once that’s done it will be into the Mary Marvel stories. Which I dearly hope she loves.
Her mother runs off the pages in full color, then puts them in plastic sleeves, back-to-back, inside a 3-ring binder, so her daughter can have the experience of actually turning the pages in a “book” while reading her first-ever comic book stories.
Then one of my editors, to whom I’d been raving about how cool was the Digital Comic Museum, said to me, “Hey, what was the name of that website you told me about, with all the Golden Age comics? I’d like to check it out.” Of course, our reading interests are pretty different. I’m all about the superheroes, with a minor in horror, whereas he’s more a gadget freak, very into cars, very into military stuff, very into military equipment. And he likes old stuff, for instance he owns, and maintains, and drives, his own Model T Ford.
The next time I talked to him, he told me, “Hey, I checked out the Digital Comic Museum. I loved it! I downloaded a few comics from the ‘50s about Navy frogmen. Y’know, back then they didn’t call them SEALs.” The next time, it was, “I downloaded a few comics from the 50s about hotrodders. Of course they weren’t really about hot rods, it’s just the adventures of this group of friends who happen to be into hotrods.”
So I said, “Hey, there’s this obscure old series of backup stories from this thing called Crack Comics titled Spitfire. It’s not about the famous British fighter plane, this is actually an American pilot whose nickname is Spitfire because of his personality. I really enjoyed it. Does that sound like anything you’d be interested in?” He said yes, so I emailed him one Spitfire story. He loved it, so I began sending him one every weekday. I knew I’d run out of Spitfire in short order because there were never that many episodes published, so I recommended Airboy. I was a little iffy on that one, because I thought it might veer a bit too much into superhero territory for him, but he loved that, too. So for awhile I was sending him one each Airboy and Spitfire, every weekday. When I ran out of Spitfire, I segued into Sky Girl from Jumbo Comics which he absolutely LOVES.
Thusfar I’m batting 1,000 percent here.
When I run out of Airboy and Sky Girl – which will take months, thankfully these were both long-running – I’m going to transition over to Blackhawk and Torchy to continue his weekdaily daring aviator/hot–tempered sexy ditz fix.
I found it very interesting to get the impressions of a guy of middle years, who has never previously gotten into comic books, as far as what he likes about them when he eventually does. These days many folks opine that sales of comic books are down because of competition from video games, the ‘net, etc. My contention has always been that it’s a combination of few outlets, over-pricing, and the fact that the content of the vast majority of today’s comic books (a) requires a huge knowledge of backstory to understand what’s going on in any particular issue, (b) just isn’t particularly fun. So why does my editor find he’s enjoying his workdaily comic book story fix so much?
His comment was, “What comic books give me that no other form of entertainment does is brevity. I don’t want to spend weeks or months or years getting really great at a particular video game. I don’t want to commit days or weeks to reading a book. I don’t even want to spend two hours watching a movie. I just want to be entertained for half an hour. So I’ll read a couple of comic book stories.”
He’s one of those guys who likes to get to work at 7 AM, before almost anyone else, just spend time having his first cup of coffee, read email, settle in for the day before things really heat up. So these days he sits there, sipping on his first cup of coffee of the day, reading the Airboy and Skygirl stories I sent him the night before.
It’s a sad commentary on the state of the comic book industry today that, in order to find stories to engage the attentions of an intelligent 9-year-old girl, and an intelligent 56-year-old editor, I had to go back in time circa 70 years. But fortunately the Digital Comic Museum is there to make that a possibility.
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Hi D,
Thanks very much for sharing your experiences with us. A fun and interesting read.
I would think Blackhawk might be a good fit with your editor. Heath draws a very realistic plane.
You also might try Canteen Kate for exceptional good girl art by Matt Baker, the best ever IMO at that kind of artwork.
You couldn't have picked better than Fawcett for kid friendly stories. I too hope your little reader enjoys them. There will be the odd non-P.C element though which is always a danger for GA books. Ethnic stereotypes are common for the era and will likely need explaining.
Let us know how things go with your readers,
-Yoc
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What a GREAT post and an amazing effort to promote DCM. You made my day. Some of those comics about Frogmen and Hot Rods no doubt originated in my collection and it's heartwarming to hear of them being welcomed into other lives.
It becomes obvious that DCM needs to create a "Daily Comic Machine" that will serve one comic story to your in-box (or printer?) based on some selection criteria. For, say, $9.99 a year you get one story per work day. It'd be just enough to accompany that first cup of coffee and would require NO investment in backstory (unless you checked the 'continuity' box). $14.99 would get you a double dose - two stories each day. Or pick more realistic numbers. It could be an app. Everything is an app these days, isn't it?
The site could eventually be self-sustainingand we might even grow a few new comics fans.
No matter. You did REAL good, D. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
Peace, Jim (|:{>
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D's story was certainly heartwarming to the staff and I'm sure the scanners out there. Knowing all the hard work is making a difference to people out there mean the world to us.
Your suggestion sounds very intriguing Jim.
Yahoo, iTunes, NetFlixs all have some kind of algorithm for suggesting other titles. Click on a genre, artist, continuity, era, publisher and see what is suggested.
I love the idea - now who could possibly put such a thing together? Not me for sure!
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I think Mark Warner is the type of guy who could figure out something like this.
RB @ Work
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What a great story
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Hi D,
Thanks very much for sharing your experiences with us. A fun and interesting read.
I would think Blackhawk might be a good fit with your editor. Heath draws a very realistic plane.
You also might try Canteen Kate for exceptional good girl art by Matt Baker, the best ever IMO at that kind of artwork.
You couldn't have picked better than Fawcett for kid friendly stories. I too hope your little reader enjoys them. There will be the odd non-P.C element though which is always a danger for GA books. Ethnic stereotypes are common for the era and will likely need explaining.
Let us know how things go with your readers,
-Yoc
I agree re the ethnic stereotypes. The level of venom and racial bigotry directed toward the Japanese in particular - especially in Captain Marvel Jr. stories for some reason - is pretty vile. Yes, I get that people were incredibly scared and pissed off about Pearl Harbor, but still.... "Nips." "Nippies." The scene where the World's Mightiest Boy has slaughtered, like, hundreds of Japanese military men, and, when they finally retreat, that line, "In the end, they turned out to be as yellow inside as they are outside."
Wow.
I screen out anything like that, before I give it to that sweet little girl. And my girlfriend appreciates that. She has told me, "Thank you for kind of vetting stuff for us first. She has some friends that are of Asian descent, and if she showed them those comics, they MIGHT understand the whole 'this was a different time' thing....and they might just assume that's the type of people we are."
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What a GREAT post and an amazing effort to promote DCM. You made my day. Some of those comics about Frogmen and Hot Rods no doubt originated in my collection and it's heartwarming to hear of them being welcomed into other lives.
It becomes obvious that DCM needs to create a "Daily Comic Machine" that will serve one comic story to your in-box (or printer?) based on some selection criteria. For, say, $9.99 a year you get one story per work day. It'd be just enough to accompany that first cup of coffee and would require NO investment in backstory (unless you checked the 'continuity' box). $14.99 would get you a double dose - two stories each day. Or pick more realistic numbers. It could be an app. Everything is an app these days, isn't it?
The site could eventually be self-sustainingand we might even grow a few new comics fans.
No matter. You did REAL good, D. Thanks for sharing your experiences.
Peace, Jim (|:{>
Thank you, Jim. Earlier today I mentioned to my editor that, after Airboy and Sky Girl are done, I will be continuing on with Blackhawk and Torchy, and he was like, "Cool!" He was genuinely pleased. I will also be taking Yoc's advice and checking out Canteen Kate. Seems that, while I thought I had gotten everything I wanted off DCM, at least for awhile, there is still more out there that I must have. :)
"Just when I thought I was out....they pulled me back IN."
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I think that the Digital Comic Museum is a great thing. I would love to be able to contribute, and not just be a consumer, but the sad truth is that I only own one Golden Age comic (albeit it's from the tail end of the Golden Age). That's Daredevil Comics #81, and you don't need a scan of that since you've already got a superb scan of that issue from Tigger. I do own quite a bit of Silver Age Marvel, and a smaller though by no means totally contemptible amount of Silver Age DC - and since I'm a total condition freak the vast majority of it is in Near Mint condition, they would make superb scans - but then you get into those pesky "rights" issues.
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No problem D.
If you ever wanted to help out with our server bill we also appreciate donations via the Donate link.
But no pressure, it's all voluntary.
The artist of Sky Girl, Matt Baker, is the master. He did a lot of romance comic work for St.John but your editor friend might not be into those.
Enjoy the goodies!
-Yoc
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Is there anything else from the Golden Age, that's not on my list of things I've already downloaded, that you consider really fine, that you'd suggest I check out? Granted that perceptions of what's "really fine" can differ between individuals, still I'm open to suggestions.
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That's kind of up to individual taste, but you might want to check out some of the collected editions if you like a particular character:
http://digitalcomicmuseum.com/index.php?cid=962
Is there anything else from the Golden Age, that's not on my list of things I've already downloaded, that you consider really fine, that you'd suggest I check out? Granted that perceptions of what's "really fine" can differ between individuals, still I'm open to suggestions.
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What about Contact Comics
http://digitalcomicmuseum.com/index.php?cid=552
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All of this, and nobody's mentioned Wings Comics, Captain Aero, or Captain Midnight? Tush!
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What about Contact Comics
http://digitalcomicmuseum.com/index.php?cid=552
What cool is in Contact Comics?
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Looking at the collected editions has given me an idea of how I can contribute to DCM. (Sorry, too poor to offer money currently.) I can do collected editions. The way my anal reten, er, detail oriented mind works is that I could never live with just having entire issues of a particular anthology, along with all the stories I don't actually want, and have to "page" through them to find and read the stories I do want. Therefore I have created files for each individual character/series that interests me, and imported that character's stories into that file. That means I already have quite a few files that contain only that character's stories.
My criteria for putting together a collection would be that I would have to have all the GA stories in which that character ever appeared. Doing partial collections would not be my thing. Also, no offense to the folks who did the original scans, but when I read a story I go through, straighten all the pages, sometimes cropping if I deem it necessary, consistent margins all the way around, and tweak the brightness and contrast until it looks good to me. I can annotate that's been done in the comments section, however. Right off the bat I could put together collections of Jeb Rivers and The Moth.
Just got to review the DCM submission guidelines and make sure I do everything right.
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If you want to submit collections, it would be a good idea NOT to tweak the pages you upload, some scanners get upset with that activity.
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Too late on that one. :( My understanding was it was okay as long as you annotated that it had been done. For instance, annotate "These pages have been straightened and had the brightness and contrast adjusted." Therefore it's clear that the This Character Complete Collection is not the ABC version, but the later tweaked XYZ version.
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There is a small number of scanners who would object. But if you've already done it don't worry about it. It likely would be a more pleasant reading experience if the pages were better matched.
It's much more important that the original scanners are given a credit for their hard work.
Rangerhouse and I like to create special covers for our collections, a credits page and TOC. I put credits on cover plates between the stories as well collected from the GCD when known.
The only other rule is if a collection equals more than 100mb in a single file to break it into two equal parts between stories or another logical place. Our software wont allow very much more than 100mb in a single file.
GL with your archives!
-Yoc
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If I might make a comment here:
I publish a magazine that reprints art from 100-year-old plus books and magazines. My philosophy is that I can do WHATEVER I want to the art I scan because I'm not changing the 'original'. It seems that the same logic applies here. Diablo666 isn't replacing the original scans with new versions, he's making copies and reusing them as he sees fit. Aren't we offering our comics and scans to the world to enjoy as they choose? I don't believe we should 'own' them once we've given them away, just as I don't believe I'm desecrating the art of those long-dead artist whose work I manipulate to MY purposes when I reprint it in my magazine. Just MAYBE diablo666 will do a better job than we did. And if not, so what? Our beautiful work is unchanged.
Peace, Jim (|:{>
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Wings came right to my mind but was afraid of the GGA. But I was thinking of the young girl they would be good for the boss.
Contact has Golden Eagle, Flamingo, Tommy Tomahawk and Black Venus all Pilot adventures
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Hi Jim,
I agree with you all the way. It's a very small number that might not agree. One hand kind of thing. To avoid any hurt feelings when making archives we've just left scans as is. Luckily Rangerhouse does a massive amount of scanning and a large number are his own.
-Yoc
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Wings came right to my mind but was afraid of the GGA. But I was thinking of the young girl they would be good for the boss.
Contact has Golden Eagle, Flamingo, Tommy Tomahawk and Black Venus all Pilot adventures
GGA?
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Good Girl Art
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I doubt whether folks who tolerate Miley Cyrus on the CMA are going to be overly sensitive to golden age comic book artists doing a few pin up poses, Narf. Times have changed and what titillates old cb fans doesn't even raise an eyebrow in the real world.
(|:{>
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Hi Jim,
I agree with you all the way. It's a very small number that might not agree. One hand kind of thing. To avoid any hurt feelings when making archives we've just left scans as is. Luckily Rangerhouse does a massive amount of scanning and a large number are his own.
-Yoc
I'm really pretty brutal about my opinion on this, Yoc, and the web goes to great lengths to back me up here. Once you've posted a copy of something, it's not yours anymore. Unless you created it originally and have some legal rights to invoke, get over it. If some scanners are feeling proprietary about their scans, they require education, not coddling. IM(not so)HO. Sorry, but reality isn't going away anytime soon.
(|:{>
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Hi Jim.
I agree on all your points.
The other consideration though - as you know - trying to massage a bad jpg into something better isn't easy. Often I find the new jpg may be straightened, etc but if there are now new jpg artifacts and blurring I often choose to leave them as-is.
-Yoc
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Re GGA. If my editor is loving Sky Girl, and finds what I told him about Torchy intriguing, obviously he is a flowering Good Girl Art aficionado.
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BTW, the 9-year-old has started reading the origin of Captain Marvel Jr. She says she finds Captain Nazi a little frightening but is still enjoying it. I didn't tell her this, but my thoughts on that matter were, "Captain Nazi IS a little frightening. But wait until Captain Marvel shows up and scares the crap out of him. It's quite satisfying."
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... I can do WHATEVER I want to the art I scan because I'm not changing the 'original'...
To which I would just add one caveat... as long as you make some attempt at noting that there was an "original" from which some of your work was inspired... not a problem with you Jim, since I believe your work is just this. I just mention it here for completeness.
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... I can do WHATEVER I want to the art I scan because I'm not changing the 'original'...
To which I would just add one caveat... as long as you make some attempt at noting that there was an "original" from which some of your work was inspired... not a problem with you Jim, since I believe your work is just this. I just mention it here for completeness.
MOST absolutely, DL. Credit always to the source and then you get to have your way with the copy.
And I also very much agree with you, Yoc, that good results from jpegs of jpegs are extremely problematical, but that should be diablo666's worry, not the first scanner's. It's a matter of what's right, not what's likely to produce the most effective results.
Peace, Jim (|:{>
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What are the good GGA series in Wings?
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Jane Martin is the only GGA feature early in Wings (some of that might not qualify). There is a lot of war stories early on without GGA (some do). That picks up at the end of the war in the various features, but it really isn't uniform in the runs.
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Other than Sky Girl, Canteen Kate, Phantom Lady and Torchy, any other outstanding GGA series?
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Sheena (own series and Jumbo), Firehair (own series and Ranger), Senorita Rio (Fight), most Planet Comic stories, Werewolf Hunter, Glory Forbes (both Ranger Comics), Judy of the Jungle (later Exciting) Princess Pantha (later Thrilling)
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Black Venus and Golden Eagle for starters.
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Black Cat, Black Orchid could not keep her clothes on. The last two appearances of Will O the Wisp in Key Comics 4 and 5 would definitely qualify. Of course there are several TEEN comics like Hickory, etc with GGA.
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Sorry it took me so long to respond to this. Interesting thread. I like Golden Age stories because they are often tightly written, fun narratives, if a bit silly sometimes.
The art is, at times, nothing short of amazing considering the amount of work people had to do. I sometimes wonder how people came up with some of the concepts they did, when there were fewer templates do draw from.
i do find some of the casual racism to be a bit of a bother. This is interesting when you consider that many of the early creators were Jews and Italians and discriminated against themselves.
I saw my first JSA story in the 70s and never looked back in my plunge into the Golden Age.
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I had already checked out Sheena, Firehair and Black Orchid. The art seems a bit crude to me, frankly. But when you start your GGA experience with Matt Baker (Phantom Lady, Sky Girl, Canteen Kate, and then Bill Ward (Torchy), you're going to wind up with some pretty high standards for your Good Girl Art.