There's No Stopping Them Now...Again (DC's renumbering)

[John C]

Most people likely get into running a comic shop based on liking comics, as opposed to having business knowledge, sadly.

In the late '80s out here, every town had at least one comic shop, and the common story was "mom (or the occasional fiancee) wanted the longboxes out of the basement," hands down.  Commercial property values had cratered to the point where three or four good customers basically covered the rent.  So if your other costs were somehow covered (see above, regarding "mom"), you could quit your job and talk about Star Trek all day...I mean, "run your business."

But, isn't the main problem only having comics in specialty shops? What is the modern equivalent of the local mom 'n pop convenience store. At least with digital, they can put free previews on websites that kids visit, that might get them started.

I agree.  From DC's perspective, this is a LONG time in coming, and I've never understood what the business reasoning was from restricting where to buy comics.

However, Yoc brings up a good point that many of the remaining stores are going to want to stay in business, of course, and doing that is going to require an overhaul so that people who know comics are available elsewhere will prefer to buy them from a local business.  That basically means making it easy to come in, browse, learn, and buy, just like "real" retail.

[dhfh]

I've hesitated weighing in on this because the relaunch makes so little difference to me, and I have less time these days to devote to comics than I have had in the past.  The newest written thing I've read was published  in 1993, I think.    I managed to hang on with DC through the first (and therefore, for me, only) universe-shattering Crisis (meaning Infinite Earths, of course, hereafter referred to as either "my off-ramp" or "the CrIE."), and for about 3 or 4 more grating years of their mixed bag of new and old stuff.  I took my off-ramp with mixed feelings of "WOW, THAT'S GREAT", and puzzlement and disgust.

That said, however, I've looked in on this thread from time to time and found that a lot of the opinions I would have posted have been voiced to some degree by either John C, paw broon, moonled, or Yoc (and maybe a few more of you—it's a long thread now).   So I'll just add some brief comments on several points raised. 

First off, I've felt for a long time that the move away from newsstands to specialty shops was a big mistake on the part of the industry.  When I was growing up you could find comic books being sold everywhere.  Then it dwindled to practically nowhere (over the decades a single new stereotypical "LCS" would crop up for a few years somewhere within 30 miles of where I live, but they never lasted).  Today comics have resurfaced a bit in book stores, but for the most part they seem largely replaced by TPBs.  Direct marketing took the comics away from the greater percentage of potential readers at large.

The irony is that direct marketing came about because the newsstand distributors had a stranglehold on the industry—so now Diamond has a stranglehold.  I suspect that the digital initiative is an attempt to get out from under this current vice grip, but I think they're just going to make things easier for the pirates: no more scanning, just buy the digitals and post copies.  If anything, I won't be surprised if it hurts DC's sales instead of helps them.

As to the relaunch plan itself, I'm still scratching my head over the choices made to re-launch the DC-EWW with.  Taking a look at the promotions brought back that great feeling I had from the CrIE.  Ah, the nostalgia!

Cases in point: for choice of characters we have Green Lantern: The New Guardians led by Kyle Rayner?  The Red Lanterns?  Mr. Terrific? 

Was Brightest Day/ Blackest Night really a producer of great characters?  Ironically, this probably has the best chance of being a good on-ramp for new people because (correct me if I'm wrong) NO READER has any prejudice about most of the New Guardians (they are called NEW after all ) or the Red Lanterns since they don't have any long historic runs hindering them in the first place.

Are the Red Lanterns really going to be new/different/more realistic/mature/interesting than any other group of so-called superheroes with homicidal "personality problems" that have cropped up since Watchmen? 

Mr. Terrific?  And I say a 3rd time: Mr. Terific?  (This owning to his being "the world’s third-smartest man – and one of its most eligible bachelors".)  With no disrespect intended for lovers of the original character, or the choice to make the new version African-American, or the new concepts/backstory for the character—why choose to make a new, realistic hero out of Mr. Terrific?  This version seems so loosely-based on the original that they could have just created a totally new character.  After all: for me the name "Mr. Terrific" alone falls under philcom55's comment about Rip Hunter's sidekicks: "well, OK maybe the names would need a little work!"  Ask yourself this: in an adult, realistic world, who decides to instill terror in the hearts of his enemies by calling himself "Mr. Terrific?"

Well, I have more to say, but no time left to say it.  So it will have to wait until later.

--DHFH

[narfstar]

Pretty much every DC comics is available the same week in pirate digital scans. So DC actually getting some money from them makes sense. Hopefully it is as my LCS believes the digital just feeds the appetite for trades.

[paw broon]

I tend to forget just how big North America is, so that I failed to appreciate that, even if there are a lot of lcs, they're are millions of folk who find themselves nowhere near one.  Also, as my actual knowledge of N.A. is limited to visits to L.A. Toronto and Montreal, where I was able to find comic shops with relative ease, I let myself be seduced by the notion that comic shops were accessible to all.
I've mentioned this before but it may have been on GAC, that here in Britain, ('80's) we had 2 distinct deliveries - new comics, which found their way to shops by sometimes odd means (e.g. picking them up from Red Star at the main rail station) and more irregularly, newsstand titles which were distributed about 3 months after the "new" titles by companies such as Menzies.  you didn't always get the same issues time after time, or parts of runs went missing but, if you didn't mind the wait and were prepared to chance your arm, you could save a bit of money.  This was for the few dedicated comic shops - and there weren't many, but the newsstand titles, which were sea freight, could be found in every corner shop, on a spinner or rack, and that had been the case for a long time.  When newsstand eventually disappeared and specialist shops were the only place to pick up new comics the market obviously shrunk. Potential new readers would hardly ever chance upon American comics. There still weren't many lcs.
And now, in Glasgow, Scotland's biggest city, there are only about 4 or 5 specialist shops and the Forbidden Planet is as much a toy store, as is, for that matter, A1, although they seem to have a bigger space for comics.  Borders closed, so there are fewer outlets for gn's and tpb's.
I hate to say it but I begin to wonder, having read some of the ideas here, that digital releases might well help comics survive in the 20odd pages of story per issue form.  Whether that is the form comics of the future should take still troubles me. But the whole concept of how comic shops look is so important.  Places that are smelly, testosterone fuelled, cliquey, not overly clean and tidy with sweary staff posing about, are not places to encourage the main bulk of the public to enter.
There are a couple of shops in London now that are getting close to attractive.  Clean, tidy, with knowledgeable staff and a good selection of comics gn's, and related stuff.  And no-one showing off.
The problem in Britain is the lack of knowledge of and interest in the medium.  The one good thing is tpb's in libraries.  That helps spread the word.

[Roygbiv666]

Mr. Terrific?  And I say a 3rd time: Mr. Terific?  (This owning to his being "the world’s third-smartest man – and one of its most eligible bachelors".)  With no disrespect intended for lovers of the original character, or the choice to make the new version African-American, or the new concepts/backstory for the character—why choose to make a new, realistic hero out of Mr. Terrific?  This version seems so loosely-based on the original that they could have just created a totally new character.  After all: for me the name "Mr. Terrific" alone falls under philcom55's comment about Rip Hunter's sidekicks: "well, OK maybe the names would need a little work!"  Ask yourself this: in an adult, realistic world, who decides to instill terror in the hearts of his enemies by calling himself "Mr. Terrific?"

Well, I have more to say, but no time left to say it.  So it will have to wait until later.

--DHFH

This Mr. Terrific has been around since 1997. Why he gets his own comic? Who knows.

http://dc.wikia.com/wiki/Mister_Terrific_(Michael_Holt)

[Roygbiv666]

I tend to forget just how big North America is, so that I failed to appreciate that, even if there are a lot of lcs, they're are millions of folk who find themselves nowhere near one.  Also, as my actual knowledge of N.A. is limited to visits to L.A. Toronto and Montreal,

Silver Snail in Toronto? That's a proper comic shop. There's also Heroes World in Markham (just north of Toronto) that's pretty nice.

[John C]

Personally, I'm hoping (but not expecting, sadly) that Mr. Terrific as a star will "fix" superheroes.  Trying not to ramble, something terrible that the '80s and '90s did was set up this bizarre notion that "the good guys" needed to be intimidating and violent.

It's not their fault, since there's been a similar shift in society--those of us in older age brackets remember cops as friendly people in powder-blue shirts walking the downtown areas and being nice to people.  Today, they sit in their cars in black paramilitary riot gear who you do NOT interrupt.

So, I'm hoping that Mr. Terrific will be a throwback to the kinds of heroes who kids (and adults) can look up to.

Granted, I'm not betting on it.  There are too many other stars who are described as thieves, killers, and so forth, plus the assorted outright villains.  But my point is that Mr. Terrific can be made to work and fill an empty niche that's been ignored ever since Batman writers started getting excited about martial arts.  I mean, remember when Batman was the World's Greatest Detective and didn't growl at everyone...?

As for losing sales to piracy, I have two quick observations, which are no more than anecdotal, but might be of interest:

First, I think digital editions will reduce piracy, overall.  It's easier to pirate an electronic product, sure, but it's also easier to buy.  Most people I've spoken to about piracy do it because the product is basically inaccessible.  Yeah, some people download Lady Gaga (she's a musician, right?) because they don't want to pay for an album, but they're not lost sales, because they weren't buying, anyway.  Most people download TV shows that they missed but can't find online and aren't out on DVD.  I'm guessing it's the same with comics.

So, by making the books easy to buy (I'd prefer cheaper, but it's not my business), they may actually cut down on piracy by preempting the pirate's audience.

Second...

http://boingboing.net/2011/05/16/piracy-sends-go-the.html

A book was Amazon's top seller BEFORE it was released, because tons of people read and passed around a leaked PDF and wanted it.  Without piracy, I doubt anybody would've heard of it.

Granted, this is a special case, because the book also has shock value, but it shows that it's entirely possible to build a marketing campaign around the pirates, rather than fighting them.  And it's worth noting that there's a substantial group of comic readers who download pirated comic scans to decide what to buy.

So DC might be in a good position to make use of these effects, especially considering that, unlike Marvel, they've actively dragged their feet when it comes to finding and stopping pirates.

Also, quick side note:  Without pirated comic scans, finding public domain comics would still be a pain in the neck.  GAC actually grew out of increasing volumes of traffic of legally-sharable material in an underground comic torrent community.  Interesting how that works, isn't it?  Most of the comics shared on the Internet Archive are copyrighted, but the pirates got it (mostly) right.

[KevinP]

What can I do to make my shop more attractive than any online experience?  Is it even possible to compete?

A little off the subject, but there was a LCS in Arkansas that was staffed by attractive young girls who wore mostly shorts and could talk comics.  Got a LOT of business even though it was a 45 minute drive from the nearest big city!

kevin

[KevinP]

Kevin, I agree.  Just focus on telling interesting stories

I guess the bottom line in this is that all the hoopla doesn't really matter to me because I have no faith in DC's ability to put out good stories, relaunch or no relaunch.

[Roygbiv666]

What can I do to make my shop more attractive than any online experience?  Is it even possible to compete?

A little off the subject, but there was a LCS in Arkansas that was staffed by attractive young girls who wore mostly shorts and could talk comics.  Got a LOT of business even though it was a 45 minute drive from the nearest big city!

kevin

Duh. ;-)

We had a barber shop like that at University - nice shampoo and scalp massage from a pretty girl, pretty nice deal.

[Yoc]

A little off the subject, but there was a LCS in Arkansas that was staffed by attractive young girls who wore mostly shorts and could talk comics.  Got a LOT of business even though it was a 45 minute drive from the nearest big city!

kevin

We'll need to see pictures to appreciate this LCS Kevin!

[John C]

A little off the subject, but there was a LCS in Arkansas that was staffed by attractive young girls who wore mostly shorts and could talk comics.  Got a LOT of business even though it was a 45 minute drive from the nearest big city!

We'll need to see pictures to appreciate this LCS Kevin!

Pictures?  Well, I guess you could start there, but phone numbers sound smarter!

[philcom55]

...Of course, in France comic shops are a different matter entirely: 

http://i55.tinypic.com/33pcwhg.jpg

Back on the subject of DC's impending relaunch I'm afraid that I'm still finding it difficult to work up any enthusiasm for all those new titles. On the other hand, one thing I am starting to get mildly curious about is the way in which the old characters will get to bow out in the final issues of their own titles. I guess it'd be too much to hope for anything in the same league as Alan Moore's "Whatever Happened to the Man of Tomorrow?" but it'd be nice if Gail Simone, for example, were allowed to end her Secret Six series in a suitably climactic blaze of glory.

Either way it seems to me that the August 'implosion' might yet prove to be far more memorable than September's promised pyrotechnics...!

 - Phil Rushton

[Yoc]

Good point there Phil.
Nice pic too.  Wonder what's in her box?

[paw broon]

Not sure if these should be here or in the links bit.  They do have a bit of relevance to this topic though. Please move them as you see fit:-
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-glasgow-west-13818534
http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/p00hlh5f
this second link being the trailer for an upcoming BBC Scotland Artworks show.  Also interesting is that none of these guys can now work for Marvel.
I don't agree with the opinions of the quality of Messrs. Morrison and Millars work, so I'll probably find myself hurling abuse at the t.v. when the show is on.
Needless to say, I missed the con as we decided to go on holiday right then.  First con in Glasgow for years and I'm in Holland.  Typical.
On lcs, Glasgow and Edinburgh stores don't have shorts clad young ladies at the counter, great shame.  I hesitate to describe some of the "gentlemen" who man the till.
And yes, Silver Snail was one of the better comic shop experiences.
 In London, I enjoy visiting Gosh, which is a really friendly, clean, well stocked wee shop with quite a knowlwdgeable staff. Also Orbita,l which is a bit bigger, clean, tidy and again the staff seem to know a bit.  But my favourite is 30th Century Comics. A real comic shop simply packed with a huge range of back issues (American, British and Australian) and those blokes really know their stuff.  A good experience.