General Category > Comic Related Discussion
Holyoke is a Myth...
JVJ (RIP):
I agree with your Harvey suggestion, bchat. As I've argued with those who try to extend some pre-Harvey connection to those titles, you can't make it retroactive just because the same group took over the titles.
It does seem much more likely that there is a connection between Brookwood and Helnit, and here's a very interesting set of facts:
1. Brookwood, Tem and Nita lasted for ONE YEAR (Speed #1) 10/39 to (Crash #4) 9/40.
2. Helnit (& Great and Choice, if you care to include them - and I do) lasted for ONE YEAR (Green Hornet #1) 12/40 to (Catman #6) 1/42.
3. Holyoke took over the two Helnit titles for ONE YEAR (Catman #7) 2/42 to (Capt Aero #10) 1/43.
4. There's a six month gap between the end of Holyoke's run and the beginning of Et-Es-Go (Capt. Aero #10) 1/43 to (Catman #7) 7/43.
5. Et-Es-Go lasted for ONE YEAR (Catman #7) 7/43 to (Capt. Aero #15 and Suspense #4) 6/44 - before turning into Continental.
6. Continental lasted TWO YEARS (Catman #25) 7/44 to (Suspense #12) 6/46.
I have no idea what all that means, but I find it curious, don't you?
(|:{>
ps. Thanks for the Sparkling Stars info.
phabox (RIP):
Slightly off topic I know but I have often wondered what the connection between St.John and Dynamic/Harry A Chesler was as some early ST.John books reprinted material from that publisher/shop.
-Nigel
bchat:
--- Quote from: JVJ on April 05, 2010, 11:38:57 PM ---I agree with your Harvey suggestion, bchat. As I've argued with those who try to extend some pre-Harvey connection to those titles, you can't make it retroactive just because the same group took over the titles.
--- End quote ---
Personally, and you may not agree with me here, I'ld like to see the first 11 issues of "Speed Comics" (and maybe the first six of "Green Hornet") moved from Harvey and grouped together with Crash Comics & Whirlwind Comics.
--- Quote ---It does seem much more likely that there is a connection between Brookwood and Helnit, and here's a very interesting set of facts:
1. Brookwood, Tem and Nita lasted for ONE YEAR (Speed #1) 10/39 to (Crash #4) 9/40.
2. Helnit (& Great and Choice, if you care to include them - and I do) lasted for ONE YEAR (Green Hornet #1) 12/40 to (Catman #6) 1/42.
--- End quote ---
Speaking of Great & Choice Comics, I'ld like to see these moved from "Unsorted" to the Helnit/Tem group.
--- Quote ---3. Holyoke took over the two Helnit titles for ONE YEAR (Catman #7) 2/42 to (Capt Aero #10) 1/43.
4. There's a six month gap between the end of Holyoke's run and the beginning of Et-Es-Go (Capt. Aero #10) 1/43 to (Catman #7) 7/43.
5. Et-Es-Go lasted for ONE YEAR (Catman #7) 7/43 to (Capt. Aero #15 and Suspense #4) 6/44 - before turning into Continental.
6. Continental lasted TWO YEARS (Catman #25) 7/44 to (Suspense #12) 6/46.
I have no idea what all that means, but I find it curious, don't you?
--- End quote ---
I find it confusing. I'll admit that I haven't been looking at this as closely as you have for as long as you have, but looking at the following info pretty much settles the debate for me:
Cover-date "November 1943":
Cat-Man Comics 21 - Et-Es-Go Magazines Inc - editorial office: 220 West 42nd Street, New York, NY - office of publication: 420 De Soto Avenue, St Louis MO
Blue Beetle 27 - Holyoke Publishing Co Inc - editorial office: 52 Vanderbilt Avenue, NYC, NY - office of publication: 1 Appleton Street, Holyoke, Mass
It seems pretty clear that I'm looking at two different publishers operating out of two different locations. You've definitely made a strong case for a group publishing name change, and your suggestion of "Tem Publishing" is probably as good as any. I think that as long as the "True Holyoke" books stay grouped with the others, there's always going to be people debating what to call everything.
--- Quote ---ps. Thanks for the Sparkling Stars info.
--- End quote ---
You're welcome.
JVJ (RIP):
I was in no way lobbying for a "group publishing name change". My initial post on this thread states my position pretty well. Holyoke was a printer who took over some comics from the "Temerson Group" and then another title from Victor Fox. After one year, whatever debt was owed by Temerson is satisfied and, after a six month gap, Temerson revives his books, adds a couple more and goes on for two years.
Fox takes longer to get out from under Holyoke, but when he does, Holyoke decides that maybe there is something to these comic books after all and starts their own title, Sparkling Stars and uses some paper to reprint the "one-shots".
No, I see Holyoke as a printer from 1940-41 turned publisher from 1942 to 1948. And your Blue Beetle 27 indicia data clearly shows that the editorial content of Blue Beetle was created in a separate office, 52 Vanderbilt, which was the same address used for the final four or five Holyoke Catman and last three Holyoke Capt. Aero comics.
Again, I don't have the Sparkling Stars and Blue Beetle info to hand and it's frustrating.
Interesting, the first thing Temerson did when he got his titles back was to move the printing to St. Louis, MO. from Holyoke, MA.
(|:{>
ps. I agree. Make a group called Tem/Nita and another called Et-Es-Go/Continental and put the books where they belong.
bchat:
--- Quote from: JVJ on April 06, 2010, 10:02:00 AM ---I was in no way lobbying for a "group publishing name change".
--- End quote ---
I agree that referring to all the books as "Holyoke" isn't accurate, as you've proved. Leaving the folder with the name "Holyoke" doesn't seem like the best thing to do if this site wants to eliminate this sort of confusion for future historians looking into the history of these companies.
--- Quote ---... Holyoke decides that maybe there is something to these comic books after all and starts their own title, Sparkling Stars and uses some paper to reprint the "one-shots".
--- End quote ---
The "Holyoke One-shots" that this site has do not contain any indicia, so my question is: How could someone like me confirm that Holyoke is the actual publisher? If none of the one-shots had an indicia, is this just a case of Overstreet assigning a publisher to books based on the contents?
And on a side note, I'm not looking to create a bunch of work for anyone by suggesting books get shuffled around (like Choice & Great Comics or the early Speed Comics), but it doesn't make sense to me to have these related books scattered througout the site. As it stands right now, it makes it inconvenient for someone investigating a situation like this to have to jump from one publisher folder to another, trying to figure-out which issue numbers were produced by different companies.
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